[Griswaldo906]

One thing I think it would be interesting to discuss is the maintenance schedule and maintenance costs on the Maverick.

I currently have a Ford CMax Hybrid and discovered a few interesting things about maintenance after buying it:

1. Oil changes are only recommended for every 10k miles or so. This may seem like a long-time to some people but, in reality, the gas engine only runs about half the time in many cases. (On my current tank of gas, 90 of 200 miles are all electric.)
2. I have actually owned 2 CMax cars and I have never had to change the tires or brake pads in over 150,000 miles of driving - 80k on one and 70k on the other.
3. There are no alternators, pulleys or belts in the CMax. I have never had any repairs in these areas on these vehicles.
4. The transmission fluid only has to be flushed after 100k miles and 50k miles thereafter.

This is to say that maintenance has been pretty cheap on the CMax hybrid and I am wondering if it will be similarly so on the Maverick.

A few things that might mitigate the savings are getting more frequent oil/transmission fluid changes due to towing, stock tires that might not have as low of a rolling resistance as what I have and brake/tire wear from carrying/towing.

If full synthetic oil, more expensive tires and shorter maintenance schedules are required on this vehicle, that might make it more expensive to operate to. Even then, relative to other trucks, including the Ecoboost model, I wonder if this truck will be a boon for people who need a versatile vehicle with an overall low cost of ownership.

 

[Wire4money]

10k mile (and even more) are very common. My Tacoma was 10k, and my Sprinter was 20k. Heck, my 1983 Toyota Celica with the unkillable 22re was 10k well before synthetic oils. The oil companies have done a great job of convincing people they need to change it every 3k.

 

[Darnon]

It's more the old timer mechanics working off 80's knowledge. The oil companies boast about protecting longer and will gladly sell you oil and filters advertising 10k or 15k mile endurance.

 

[Wire4money]

It's more the old timer mechanics working off 80's knowledge. The oil companies boast about protecting longer and will gladly sell you oil and filters advertising 10k or 15k mile endurance.

It’s the vehicle manufacturers advertising these oil intervals. With modern engines and oils, 3k intervals are a waste.

 

[VonnVary]

One thing I think it would be interesting to discuss is the maintenance schedule and maintenance costs on the Maverick.

I currently have a Ford CMax Hybrid and discovered a few interesting things about maintenance after buying it:

1. Oil changes are only recommended for every 10k miles or so. This may seem like a long-time to some people but, in reality, the gas engine only runs about half the time in many cases. (On my current tank of gas, 90 of 200 miles are all electric.)
2. I have actually owned 2 CMax cars and I have never had to change the tires or brake pads in over 150,000 miles of driving - 80k on one and 70k on the other.
3. There are no alternators, pulleys or belts in the CMax. I have never had any repairs in these areas on these vehicles.
4. The transmission fluid only has to be flushed after 100k miles and 50k miles thereafter.

This is to say that maintenance has been pretty cheap on the CMax hybrid and I am wondering if it will be similarly so on the Maverick.

A few things that might mitigate the savings are getting more frequent oil/transmission fluid changes due to towing, stock tires that might not have as low of a rolling resistance as what I have and brake/tire wear from carrying/towing.

If full synthetic oil, more expensive tires and shorter maintenance schedules are required on this vehicle, that might make it more expensive to operate to. Even then, relative to other trucks, including the Ecoboost model, I wonder if this truck will be a boon for people who need a versatile vehicle with an overall low cost of ownership.

Griswaldo,

Did you ever have any issues with the regenerative breaking? Any maintenance that was reccomended to you on either C-Max?

 

[Griswaldo906]

Did you ever have any issues with the regenerative breaking? Any maintenance that was reccomended to you on either C-Max?

I never had any issue whatsoever with the regenerative braking... I believe the regenerative breaking is done by the "generator" motor in the transmission. My dealership even told me that brake maintenance works the exact same on my CMax as on any other Ford. Therefore, I don't believe the braking system has any extra hardware at the wheels.

 

[VonnVary]

I never had any issue whatsoever with the regenerative braking... I believe the regenerative breaking is done by the "generator" motor in the transmission. My dealership even told me that brake maintenance works the exact same on my CMax as on any other Ford. Therefore, I don't believe the braking system has any extra hardware at the wheels.

I didn't know that. That makes me feel better about repairs/maintenance. How seamless was the transition from gasoline engine off to engine on? Did you find large delays?

 

[Griswaldo906]

I didn't know that. That makes me feel better about repairs/maintenance. How seamless was the transition from gasoline engine off to engine on? Did you find large delays?

The transition to starting the gas engine is very smooth and can happen at any time to power the wheels or accessories. I pretty much never feel the engine kick in, except maybe in very cold weather. I usually don't hear it either. Most of the time I don't notice at all. Because the electric motor is running through the process there is never any interruption in acceleration or accessory function.

 

[Shark]

One thing I think it would be interesting to discuss is the maintenance schedule and maintenance costs on the Maverick.

I currently have a Ford CMax Hybrid and discovered a few interesting things about maintenance after buying it:

1. Oil changes are only recommended for every 10k miles or so. This may seem like a long-time to some people but, in reality, the gas engine only runs about half the time in many cases. (On my current tank of gas, 90 of 200 miles are all electric.)
2. I have actually owned 2 CMax cars and I have never had to change the tires or brake pads in over 150,000 miles of driving - 80k on one and 70k on the other.
3. There are no alternators, pulleys or belts in the CMax. I have never had any repairs in these areas on these vehicles.
4. The transmission fluid only has to be flushed after 100k miles and 50k miles thereafter.

This is to say that maintenance has been pretty cheap on the CMax hybrid and I am wondering if it will be similarly so on the Maverick.

A few things that might mitigate the savings are getting more frequent oil/transmission fluid changes due to towing, stock tires that might not have as low of a rolling resistance as what I have and brake/tire wear from carrying/towing.

If full synthetic oil, more expensive tires and shorter maintenance schedules are required on this vehicle, that might make it more expensive to operate to. Even then, relative to other trucks, including the Ecoboost model, I wonder if this truck will be a boon for people who need a versatile vehicle with an overall low cost of ownership.

on the new rangers which are all gas, i believe the recommendation is every 10k miles to start, then only every 20k miles once it hits 60k miles.

So it's likely nothing to do with it being a hybrid. In fact that Maverick Hybrid recommendation is more often than on the all gas Ranger as above.

A lot of people really seems to push back against the fact that cars just dont need oil changed much anymore, I see lots of people vowing to change every 5k miles no matter what the manufacturer says etc (which more oil changes would be very bad for the environment etc) (funny thing is the manufacturer will only be ultra conservative, so I imagine the REAL needed oil change intervals on the Ranger are even less than whatever Ford will tell you)

Myself on my 08 Canyon I switched to annual oil changes some years ago and the engine still purrs after 135k miles. It's so old I'm sure the recommendation is much more often, but I dont care. I use the high mileage synthetic guaranteed for 15k miles and same for oil filter, I make sure to get the one rated for 15k miles which costs a little more. I dont skimp. I only drive 12k miles per year, so I only save one change per yr probably, but it's worth it as I change it myself.

Myself I have just been looking at my Canyon and I never did anything to it LOL. The Water Pump went out a couple years ago, $100 fix that my Dad did for me so at that time luckily the coolant was also changed. I've never changed the air filter LOL, still runs great. But I ordered one from Amazon and will put that in any day now. The other thing is the transmission fluid. I was afraid I'd waited far too long at 135k miles, but the manual only recommends once at 100k miles and thats it, so I'm not too far behind.

The thing I would worry about on a hybrid is that battery. They have a 8 yr warranty, which probably isn't coincidence. Unlike many people I tend to drive my cars indefinitely, so something have a 8 yr possible time bomb in it isn't cool. Again my Canyon is from 08, so 13 years. Guessing a hybrid isnt making that without a several thousands battery change.

Most people switch out their car every few years. I was asking this guy the other day if he thought his brand new car would be easy to repair, He said the starter is easy to get to, then he basically laughed it off with "i'll get a new one in 4 or 5 years anyway". He has the money to do that. So it's a different calculus for a lot of people and me.

 

[Newbernwolf]

on the new rangers which are all gas, i believe the recommendation is every 10k miles to start, then only every 20k miles once it hits 60k miles.

So it's likely nothing to do with it being a hybrid. In fact that Maverick Hybrid recommendation is more often than on the all gas Ranger as above.

A lot of people really seems to push back against the fact that cars just dont need oil changed much anymore, I see lots of people vowing to change every 5k miles no matter what the manufacturer says etc (which more oil changes would be very bad for the environment etc) (funny thing is the manufacturer will only be ultra conservative, so I imagine the REAL needed oil change intervals on the Ranger are even less than whatever Ford will tell you)

Myself on my 08 Canyon I switched to annual oil changes some years ago and the engine still purrs after 135k miles. It's so old I'm sure the recommendation is much more often, but I dont care. I use the high mileage synthetic guaranteed for 15k miles and same for oil filter, I make sure to get the one rated for 15k miles which costs a little more. I dont skimp. I only drive 12k miles per year, so I only save one change per yr probably, but it's worth it as I change it myself.

Myself I have just been looking at my Canyon and I never did anything to it LOL. The Water Pump went out a couple years ago, $100 fix that my Dad did for me so at that time luckily the coolant was also changed. I've never changed the air filter LOL, still runs great. But I ordered one from Amazon and will put that in any day now. The other thing is the transmission fluid. I was afraid I'd waited far too long at 135k miles, but the manual only recommends once at 100k miles and thats it, so I'm not too far behind.

The thing I would worry about on a hybrid is that battery. They have a 8 yr warranty, which probably isn't coincidence. Unlike many people I tend to drive my cars indefinitely, so something have a 8 yr possible time bomb in it isn't cool. Again my Canyon is from 08, so 13 years. Guessing a hybrid isnt making that without a several thousands battery change.

Most people switch out their car every few years. I was asking this guy the other day if he thought his brand new car would be easy to repair, He said the starter is easy to get to, then he basically laughed it off with "i'll get a new one in 4 or 5 years anyway". He has the money to do that. So it's a different calculus for a lot of people and me.

Hybrid batteries routinely last the life of the vehicle. You'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who's replaced one.

 

[Shark]

Hybrid batteries routinely last the life of the vehicle. You'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who's replaced one.

Just watched a vid about electric car batteries degradation. Was pretty severe on Nissan Leaf (15% capacity loss in 3 yrs, on a car with already paltry 73 mile range further lessened in the cold), pretty good on Tesla (90% capacity after 8 years). Doubt a generic statement covers much. Got anything more official?

Googled this

"Most hybrid vehicle manufacturers say that, on average, a hybrid battery pack will last from 80,000 to 100,000 miles. Prior to 2020, Toyota went further by offering a warranty that covered its hybrid batteries for eight years or 100,000 miles, whichever came first. However, in 2019, the manufacturer announced that, from the 2020 model year, it was extending its hybrid battery warranty to 10 years from the date of first use, or 150,000 miles."

Ford should increase to 10 yr/150k too. still not enough but would help.

Batteries also suffer "calendar degradation", which means just sitting their over time harms then too not only mileage or charge cycles. LOL the things you learn from youtube. Pretty interesting stuff.

It was said the main reason Leaf batteries fared so poorly was they had no internal cooling to protect them EG, sitting on a hot parking lot, where the Teslas do. Heat was the #1 killer of batteries. Leaf owners in Arizona suffered problems first.

 

[Newbernwolf]

Just watched a vid about electric car batteries degradation. Was pretty severe on Nissan Leaf (15% capacity loss in 3 yrs, on a car with already paltry 73 mile range further lessened in the cold), pretty good on Tesla (90% capacity after 8 years). Doubt a generic statement covers much. Got anything more official?

Nissan Leaf isn't a hybrid.

 

[Griswaldo906]

on the new rangers which are all gas, i believe the recommendation is every 10k miles to start, then only every 20k miles once it hits 60k miles.

This is interesting. Before my 1st CMax, I guess I never owned a car that recommended 10k oil change.

 

[Toddio12]

on the new rangers which are all gas, i believe the recommendation is every 10k miles to start, then only every 20k miles once it hits 60k miles.

So it's likely nothing to do with it being a hybrid. In fact that Maverick Hybrid recommendation is more often than on the all gas Ranger as above.

A lot of people really seems to push back against the fact that cars just dont need oil changed much anymore, I see lots of people vowing to change every 5k miles no matter what the manufacturer says etc (which more oil changes would be very bad for the environment etc) (funny thing is the manufacturer will only be ultra conservative, so I imagine the REAL needed oil change intervals on the Ranger are even less than whatever Ford will tell you)

Myself on my 08 Canyon I switched to annual oil changes some years ago and the engine still purrs after 135k miles. It's so old I'm sure the recommendation is much more often, but I dont care. I use the high mileage synthetic guaranteed for 15k miles and same for oil filter, I make sure to get the one rated for 15k miles which costs a little more. I dont skimp. I only drive 12k miles per year, so I only save one change per yr probably, but it's worth it as I change it myself.

Myself I have just been looking at my Canyon and I never did anything to it LOL. The Water Pump went out a couple years ago, $100 fix that my Dad did for me so at that time luckily the coolant was also changed. I've never changed the air filter LOL, still runs great. But I ordered one from Amazon and will put that in any day now. The other thing is the transmission fluid. I was afraid I'd waited far too long at 135k miles, but the manual only recommends once at 100k miles and thats it, so I'm not too far behind.

The thing I would worry about on a hybrid is that battery. They have a 8 yr warranty, which probably isn't coincidence. Unlike many people I tend to drive my cars indefinitely, so something have a 8 yr possible time bomb in it isn't cool. Again my Canyon is from 08, so 13 years. Guessing a hybrid isnt making that without a several thousands battery change.

Most people switch out their car every few years. I was asking this guy the other day if he thought his brand new car would be easy to repair, He said the starter is easy to get to, then he basically laughed it off with "i'll get a new one in 4 or 5 years anyway". He has the money to do that. So it's a different calculus for a lot of people and me.

I have a 2005 Escape hybrid with over 200,000 miles. Original hybrid battery. This is not uncommon at all.
Early Honda hybrids had some battery issues and some GM mild hybrids (Silverado, Tahoe) had battery problems. Some early Toyota Prius had busbar issues inside the battery corroding, but I have heard of no widespread issues with batteries on any Ford products. I don't even know a Ford tech who has replaced one. I'm sure some have failed, but it nowhere near as common as you make it out to be. It's really a non-issue.

Of course, every new car may introduce that one new part that spoils the whole system. But I'll go with Fords track history on this.

 

[Toddio12]

And don't forget this. I talked about it in an earlier post, but found this, new updated version.

Autotrader - page unavailable

 

[Griswaldo906]

Just watched a vid about electric car batteries degradation. Was pretty severe on Nissan Leaf (15% capacity loss in 3 yrs, on a car with already paltry 73 mile range further lessened in the cold), pretty good on Tesla (90% capacity after 8 years). Doubt a generic statement covers much. Got anything more official?

The cars you are referring to are full electric vehicles that may routinely charge their batteries to 100% and discharge their batteries to close to 100%. This is VERY hard on the battery, depending on its type.

Ford does use lithium-ion batteries (which are prone) but I read that their hybrids optimize the charge/discharge cycle to keep them between 70% and 30%. This means that not only do the batteries not lose much capacity over a relatively long period of time but you probably wouldn't notice it even if they did. In addition, I believe the Maverick hybrid was reported to have active cooling for its batteries, in contrast to passive cooling that was an issue for many Nissan Leafs.

Btw, I wouldn't call any of my commentary "more official" but, having owned two Ford hybrids, I would say I have probably done as much research on the topic as nearly anybody here.

 

[Shark]

The cars you are referring to are full electric vehicles that may routinely charge their batteries to 100% and discharge their batteries to close to 100%. This is VERY hard on the battery, depending on its type.

Ford does use lithium-ion batteries (which are prone) but I read that their hybrids optimize the charge/discharge cycle to keep them between 70% and 30%. This means that not only do the batteries not lose much capacity over a relatively long period of time but you probably wouldn't notice it even if they did. In addition, I believe the Maverick hybrid was reported to have active cooling for its batteries, in contrast to passive cooling that was an issue for many Nissan Leafs.

Btw, I wouldn't call any of my commentary "more official" but, having owned two Ford hybrids, I would say I have probably done as much research on the topic as nearly anybody here.

No, the video mentioned that, all electric cars only expose the 80%-20% part of the battery. Smart.

What says 0 is 20% etc. Consumer is not allowed to access 0-100.

 

[Griswaldo906]

No, the video mentioned that, all electric cars only expose the 80%-20% part of the battery. Smart.

I wouldn’t dispute that as I haven’t done the same kind of research on full electric cars.

What I will say is that people forget Ford has been making hybrids for over 15 years and really know what they are doing. There is a huge amount of data out there suggesting their batteries can easily outlast the 150-200k lifecycle many people expect of their vehicles.

 

[Dbarr]

Hybrid batteries routinely last the life of the vehicle. You'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who's replaced one.

I gave my son my 2007 Camry Hybrid. First failure was @ 230k, and he had the failed modules replace. Second failure was 320ish… then replaced entire battery pack, which is the way to go… It has become a pretty good business and battery companies will even come to you and install. And to commit on another post, only front brake pads replaced once… I still miss that car

 

[Newbernwolf]

There's just no real world evidence that hybrid battery failure is any more likely than the failure of any other major component of a motor vehicle. It's been studied a lot. The only reason hybrid batteries have such long warranties compared to the rest of the vehicle parts is because scaredy cats keep suggesting that hybrid batteries don't last.

Could it happen? Sure. Anything CAN happen. Back in 2000, I had to replace a transmission on a regular Honda Accord at 52k. Does that mean Honda Accords have weak transmissions? No. It was an anomaly.

I'd worry more about replacing the gas tank than I would about hybrid battery failure.